hasunoha

What's the difference between enlightenment and giving up?

 Enlightenment is about giving up after all, isn't it?

Due to the recent enlightenment boom, it is often said in various books that tolerating “here and now” and “who you are” is enlightenment, and Buddha also said, “Don't devour, know what is enough.”

But isn't this a matter of giving up after all?

The reason Buddha was able to say “don't devour, desire is empty” is something you only noticed when Buddha was born into an aristocrat and played a lot with money, alcohol, and women when he was young, right?

I don't think people who have created luxury can be conveyed to people who have never created luxury, even if they say that desire is futile... Well, I feel like if everyone plays with money, alcohol, and women, it's going to be boring.

Therefore, since there are no desires attached, let's tolerate who we are now is simply

You don't have any money, so give up
You can't get married because you're ugly, give up
You can't predict the future, give up

It only sounds like they're saying that in extremely beautiful words.

Certainly, once you've accepted who you are and your current situation, you'll only be like this for a moment, “You can just leave it like this!” It makes me feel so much easier, but later I focus on my miserable self, which is different from the person who is satisfied due to reaction, and I get caught in a whirlpool of negativity.

After all, isn't enlightenment a state where you successfully trick your brain from an unfortunate situation, or a state where you have given up cleanly?

I'm sorry for the long messy text. We are waiting for lots of answers.

6 Zen Responses

The story of the process

Nice to meet you.

It seems that knowledge has been absorbed from various places, but the interpretation is slightly different.

It may be no wonder that enlightenment is seen as abandonment at first glance, but it seems a little too early to conclude that.

It's quite impossible to explain enlightenment itself in sentences, but apparently, being convinced is being mistaken for enlightenment.

Enlightenment and conviction are completely different things.
What's more, fooling your worries or giving up is a state where you're not even convinced.

When people are convinced, their mind calms down.
Things you are once convinced of are things that never come out on the surface again.

Something that comes up two or three times is deceiving my worries by telling it to something I can't give up.
Fool your brain and give up. Both are far from enlightenment.

The Buddha taught the “middle way.”
It's difficult to explain, but in simple terms, it means “not biased against either.”

Accepting the way it is is also completely different from “you can leave it as it is” if the way it is is biased.

We feel unhappy because we compare money, appearance, and future with something, and because pain is born from begging for something we don't have, it's just that we start by accepting it as it is, and it's just a passing point for the first step.

First, why don't you start by being neutral about everything?

There is no “as-is” world in a relativized world

Nice to meet you. My name is Kameyama Junshi. I would like to talk about the perception of “as is” in Buddhism.

What kind of perception is “who you are”? For example, “I'm 170 cm tall, 65 kg, my hobby is listening to music, and I'm currently in my fourth year of college.” Is this perception a recognition of “who I am as I am?” “As is” means “cannot be relativized.” So if you try to look at things “as they are,” they won't arise from a relativized view. However, there is no perception that cannot be relativized in our everyday perceptions. We're always looking at things in relativism. For example, when you say “rich,” do you mean someone who has how much money? When you say “poor people,” do you mean people who don't have much money? Are people who have 1 million yen rich? If you look at it from one person, you're probably rich, and if you look at it from others, you're probably poor. Or is there an “right that is not relativized”? If you look at it from one direction, it's on the right, but if you look at it from another direction, it's on the left. This is true even when it comes to relationships. An older brother becomes an older brother when a younger brother is born. I don't have an older brother who is an only child. As you can see, all of our perceptions are relative perceptions. On the other hand, “as is” means “cannot be relativized,” so “the self as is” is the “self that cannot be relativized,” and it is the self that can be found beyond our verbal recognition. By no means is the perception of “myself without money,” “my ugly self,” and “my self with no prospects for the future,” a perception of “who I am as I am.” And Buddha is a person who can see things with that perception that “cannot be relativized”, a perception that “goes beyond words.”

It's different from giving up

I think giving up and enlightenment are different things.
Isn't giving up a state where patience still remains somewhere in the heart, or a state where unreasonable has occurred somewhere?
Don't let your desires be satisfied, stop it after eight minutes. I think this is an ingenuity to prevent them from having more desires.
I think the state of enlightenment is a state of not putting up with it, not giving up, and accepting it as it is. There is no self. Since I don't have myself, I won't give up.
Please put it into practice and explore that path.

Are enlightenment (giving up/revealing) and abandonment different

Enlightenment (giving up, revealing) is something you really don't want. In other words, it's about being satisfied and not dissatisfied.
In response to this, what is often called “give up” in the world is to give up. In other words, it's like stopping when you really want it.
I really don't want enlightenment, so I'm not giving up or putting up with losing weight.
There are things that children want and say they want, but when you become an adult, there are things you don't want anymore.
So, is that adult unhappy?
That's not true.
Isn't enlightenment about becoming the ultimate adult?

Enlightenment = Buddha's state

I will answer from the standpoint of the Jodo Shinshu sect.

Enlightenment is the Buddha's state, so humans cannot experience it.
“Becoming a Buddha” = “enlightenment,” so there's no such thing as enlightenment but not becoming a Buddha.
Also, enlightenment (Buddha) is immortal, and once in a while, enlightenment does not return to normal human thought.

Giving up is a normal human thought.
That and enlightenment are completely different.
“What's the difference between giving up and enlightenment?” If asked, I can only say, “There is no comparison between human thoughts and Buddha's thoughts.”

The difference between sad silence and refreshing silence

Any human being can quiet their mind if they really want to be quiet.

Please shut up for 21 seconds.
Please stop thinking about the past in 7 seconds.
Please stop thinking about the future in 7 seconds.
Please finish your current thoughts in 7 seconds.
...

Now, what about the “quality” of that silence?

There are various mental frequencies, even when it comes to silence.
Sad silence, dark silence, unreassuring silence, ♬ temporary silence where sound is resting, silence unaffected by thoughts... silence where you can stay calm no matter what happens...

Is it a silence where people say they have no money, are ugly, and have no prospects, and are sad and silent, and they don't do anything?
Is it silence that can be patted even when they say that there is no money, ugly, or no prospects?

Is it silence that allows us to act without remaining silent, without giving up there?

The silence of enlightenment is silence where human values do not enter.
It's a very refreshing and bright silence.

Don't you feel like there's a negative image of giving up?
(-_-;)... it's already bad, I want to do this but I can't do it, I'm disappointed, I'm shocked...

There is no such thing in the silence of enlightenment.
I don't have any money, I'm a buchak, and I'm not as talented as someone,
You don't have to give up anything,
Even when such words are said, as a negative meaning, they have a state of mind that does not function or affect the brain.

Even with the same silence, it's completely different.

“Settling for the facts” while being here and now
It's a different dimension from being here and now while holding on the thought pedal of “wake up thoughts and thoughts” ❝ give up ❞.

This is because enlightenment has no grip or grip.
If you are interested, please experience and demonstrate for yourself what a state of “enlightenment” means at a zazen session.
What you lack is the courage to know, assess, and face the quality of your silence.